tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3070851492409174635.post1883794143547197930..comments2023-06-29T10:27:17.465+01:00Comments on Fancyplants' Cracked Pot: All Aboard the Atheist Bus!fancyplantshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12244126228958448766noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3070851492409174635.post-17812108832639431612008-11-09T01:59:00.000+00:002008-11-09T01:59:00.000+00:00Hi Laura,I agree - my take with the word 'Probably...Hi Laura,<BR/><BR/>I agree - my take with the word 'Probably' is down very much the same lines; if you remove it, you are effectively believing that God doesn't exist in the same way that theists believe that he does. Neither side can prove it, and both rely on a faith of sorts to make it add up in their minds. It thus leads to a catch 22 situation - I thought the point of atheism is to not have a belief system at all.<BR/><BR/>Its inclusion I believe had two purposes: to minimise the potential offence caused to those who do believe, and to appease the bus companies who would carry the slogan, who would not accept the posters in there original 'probably'-free form. See <A HREF="http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2008/oct/23/atheist-bus-campaign-ariane-sherine" REL="nofollow">this post</A> on the Comment Is Free site for a more in-depth explanation on its inclusion.<BR/><BR/>As for preaching these beliefs on the side of a bus, I personally donated for the reason that the religious types happily invade my life with slogans and street preachers and door-to-door Jesus-sellers on a daily basis, all assuming that I accept there is a God somewhere looking down on me, never thinking for a moment that this central assumption may irritate and possibly offend myself and other people too. A counter slogan that said the opposite sounded like a redressing of the balance, even if the form of the message may raise questions, which it definitely has. One of the most immediate is why has this clearly widely-held atheist view not been heard so loudly before?fancyplantshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12244126228958448766noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3070851492409174635.post-59288396461387978842008-11-08T20:38:00.000+00:002008-11-08T20:38:00.000+00:00I feel quite ambivalent about this bus. After all,...I feel quite ambivalent about this bus. After all, are not the atheists preaching their own beliefs, for surely the denial of a god is just as much an unfounded 'belief' as the acknowledgement of one? I know that the word 'probably' connotes agnosticism, but was it included merely to lessen potential offence? I am not trying to attack your post, just to try to get my head around such issues! By the way, I do assign myself to any form of religion, agnosticism or atheism.logofintriguehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04803755273081423628noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3070851492409174635.post-3353099387888929512008-10-25T21:33:00.000+01:002008-10-25T21:33:00.000+01:00Wow! Hi Simon! Your donation to get it over the ...Wow! Hi Simon! Your donation to get it over the ton was fantastic especially when combined with your earlier one as well. You will go down as a bit of a hero (you're already on the wikipedia entry!)<BR/>Yes, I realise now that my suggestion was not so well thought out given that everyone had pledged based on the initial premise, changing the outcome would not be fair regardless of how deserving the charity. Apologies to anyone who may have been offended. Really glad you enjoyed your visit to my blog otherwise though! :)fancyplantshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12244126228958448766noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3070851492409174635.post-55748915035927588152008-10-25T13:13:00.000+01:002008-10-25T13:13:00.000+01:00Thanks for the link from the donations page.I very...Thanks for the link from the donations page.<BR/>I very much liked almost all of your post, but I agree with anonymous that we should not divert money from this campaign to other charitable causes, however worthwhile they might be.<BR/>I have donated £4000 so far, on the understanding that the money would be used for atheist advertising. I would feel cheated to discover that it had been used for any other unrelated purpose.<BR/>Sorry if this makes me sound mean, but the cause behind this campaign is atheism and should remain so.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3070851492409174635.post-87946073425100341372008-10-24T19:39:00.000+01:002008-10-24T19:39:00.000+01:00Thanks rob/anonymous!Just been out shopping and th...Thanks rob/anonymous!<BR/>Just been out shopping and the subject has been boinging around my head all the time. I guess a way to decide would be for the campaign organisers to throw open the decision of what should happen with all the extra money (that's surplus after everything they said they would do) to a public vote, one option of which would be to use it all for its original/modified purpose (that is, sides of buses, inside buses/trains, billboards etc.) but on a still bigger/longer scale and then other options such as funding text books in schools, nominating a beneficial source, or whatever. Like rob says, it would be down the line a bit - the justgiving site doesn't end til' April!<BR/><BR/>And its now over £101k! Woohoo!!fancyplantshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12244126228958448766noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3070851492409174635.post-32580295950082659722008-10-24T18:22:00.000+01:002008-10-24T18:22:00.000+01:00Sorry - I panicked there a bit! As an extremely po...Sorry - I panicked there a bit! As an extremely poor aged pensioner I went into grumpy-old-woman mode:-) I agree, they wouldn't change the goalposts after stating their aims. As I believe humans bring it on themselves, the only charities I donate to - apart from the atheist bus - are animal charities, in an attempt to redress the dastardly behaviour of the human race towards them - and I'm sure there are many who would throw up their hands in horror at my choice of charities:-)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3070851492409174635.post-30845058722968791782008-10-24T18:13:00.000+01:002008-10-24T18:13:00.000+01:00nice post. i actually think that the point about ...nice post. i actually think that the point about giving to good causes is considered, but probably something for much further down the line: it risks confusing the message.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3070851492409174635.post-19041181605869529432008-10-24T18:06:00.000+01:002008-10-24T18:06:00.000+01:00Whoa, please don't slow the money flow just becaus...Whoa, please don't slow the money flow just because of my yammerings!! I agree with you that if such a thing were to happen (the alternative things to spend the cash on) then it should be set out from the start in the justgiving page, of which I have no affiliation or sway with, so it can't realistically be expected to happen now when so many people have donated. <BR/>My bad entirely. My point I guess was that the amount currently being raised stretches far beyond the amount originally envisaged for the project, and you can only do so much postering with that money before it becomes overkill, so why not find some other worthy causes in the humanist/atheist name? I agree though that perhaps my suggestions of where else it could go were perhaps controversial, but I chose them because the Christian Voice wouldn't have a leg to stand on when it came to a reaction.fancyplantshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12244126228958448766noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3070851492409174635.post-26283757385824365142008-10-24T17:54:00.000+01:002008-10-24T17:54:00.000+01:00I agree almost entirely with your comments but am ...I agree almost entirely with your comments but am horrified that you suggest using some of the money we've donated for the campaign to support other charities. I did not donate for the money to go to charities that address issues that are partly caused by greedy corporations, corrupt power elites etc. and by human beings not taking responsibility for their health and/or families. I donated so there could be debate and open rational discussion rather than people being forced to be 'tolerant', i.e. accept the death and suffering-causing organized religions. However I'm now not going to donate again just in case some of my money is going to be used to support other charities.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com